Cop cars

By World's Editorial Writers - 11/7/2009


Tulsa police may have a legitimate stance on the vehicle take-home practice, but their hard-headed refusal to offer any more concessions in the wake of the most extreme budget crisis of recent times isn't going to win them any new friends.

A lot of folks are going to remember their obstinacy when the time comes to negotiate new contract terms. And if the police are entertaining any notion of a dedicated public-safety tax — they recently called for exploring new revenue sources — they haven't done their campaign for such a measure any good.

Police union leaders announced Thursday a vote against further concessions sought by Mayor Kathy Taylor, who had asked the union to consider giving up the practice of taking vehicles home. (Only about 25 percent of the union's membership voted on the matter, which makes us wonder what the other 75 percent feel about the issue.)

The vehicle take-home practice, negotiated during the previous mayor's administration, allows cops to take cars outside the city limits, a practice that now must be weighed against the city's severely limited resources.

Of course it's clear the take-home practice is a benefit that's part of the total compensation package. But that's beside the point right now. Concessions are being forced on departments throughout the city; in fact, 16 other city workers and three police officers had to make the ultimate employment sacrifice — losing their jobs.

Luckily for the police department, 18 of their members recently laid off have been rehired thanks to federal stimulus funding, and the other three have chances for other decent jobs. But that's not the case for the other 16 city workers.

City Councilor Rick Westcott contends giving up the take-home practice would have saved the jobs of all the employees recently laid off, as well as preserved the police mounted patrol and helicopter functions.

If the city budget crisis continues for months to come, even more drastic action may be required. City leaders have warned more layoffs might be necessary. Police may have just ensured more of their number will ultimately lose their jobs.

It's understandable some cops don't want to give up a benefit that's an element of their contract; after all, they can point to surveys showing they are underpaid compared to some of the counterparts. But is hanging on to vehicle take-home privileges so important in light of the extraordinary circumstances the city is facing?


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Tulsa World Reader Comments
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2curious, Tulsa, OK 74104 (11/7/2009 4:48:58 PM)
I have a police officer that lives down the block from us...and I LOVE that her patrol car sits there during off-duty hours. It helps keep this neighborhood safe simply by being seen. This costs us (taxpayers) relatively little compared to the safety it generates. LET THEM TAKE THE CARS HOME!!!

FUTURE WORLD, Tulsa (11/7/2009 6:52:38 PM)
We'll see how this all shakes out in the next contract.

JCash, Tulsa (11/7/2009 11:21:43 PM)
Obviously, the car issue outside the city limits is a hot-button issue. But the car issue is just one element of a different problem confronting ALL city workers. Compensation, pure and simple. If the cars are returned, no questions asked, will you make up for it with a different form of compensation? Is this “give and take” or just “take?” What say you?

tbgalileo, Tulsa (11/7/2009 7:56:06 AM)
TW, why should the police officers be required to give more than any other city employee? They have already accepted the pay cuts that all city employees took (for which they were told no layoffs would happen). Do tell what additional benefits all other city employees are giving up? Why are police officers' paychecks considered the fallback piggy bank for a poorly-run city?

Webmeister, Tulsa (11/7/2009 9:50:01 AM)
There is no public safety benefit to Tulsa taxpayers of a Tulsa Police car parked in a suburban residential driveway in Jenks, Bixby, Broken Arrow, Catoosa, Skiatook, Collinsville, Owasso, Sand Springs, or Sapulpa. None. Zippo. Nada.

Moses, Jenks (11/7/2009 6:42:52 PM)
I certainly appreciate the Tulsa police cars parked in Jenks! Quite a few Tulsa officers live over this way!

Exchanging views, Tulsa (11/7/2009 9:29:53 PM)
Ok, let the vehicles be parked at spots other than the Uniform Division when not in use. But be fair, and rotate the spots where they park them. Have equal numbers parked on all 4 sides of town, not just in the officer's neighborhood's. This will ensure equal time for criminal activity being decreased in all neighborhoods, and ensure the vehicle is parked and not in use when the officer is off duty.

WhereIsThought, Raleigh (11/7/2009 10:03:59 AM)
Webmeister, You're wrong about you're really cool way of saying "no" 4 ways. There are studies that the parked cars DO correlate to lower crime rates. The question is, WHERE do you park them to have the greatest effect? In Cary, NC, the police park their unused cars in strip mall and shopping center parking lots, bank parking lots, etc., and the crime rates in THOSE areas actually do go down. A study by Police Fleet Magazine analyzed the impact of take-home cars on midsized urban cities like Tulsa. It claimed to show a direct correlation between take-home cars and crime rates. The magazine reported take-home cars directly contributed to a 3.1 percent reduction in nonviolent crimes in Tacoma, Wash. It also claimed that the reduction in property crime rates resulted in higher property values, which translated into more revenue for the city. So, the question is, do you park the cars in Sand Springs and Sapulpa and reduce THEIR crime rates, or do you park them in the city commercial centers and reduce THEIR crime rates. Parking the police cars in the parking lots of high-traffic areas would have a positive impact, but the police union FIRST has to agree not to selfishly take the cars out of the city limits. If they conceed THAT much, then maybe we can get the cars out of the police garage and out where they can be of use to the city of Tulsa, not the surrounding towns.

Thunder196, Tulsa (11/7/2009 8:10:42 AM)
They are expected to do a lot of things. They are expected to act like grown adults. Right now I have no respect for them. They are a bunch of whiners, it's mine and you can't have it. . Before someone says wait til you need them. They are getting paid to do a job, no matter how I feel about them. It is their actions I don't like.

SKT, (11/7/2009 2:05:15 PM)
What the mayor doesn't tell you is the fact that the take home car is part of our pay check and not a benefit. It was provided to us by mayor Lafortune because he couldn't afford to give us a raise. If Taylor want's to take away the cars, fine give us the raise. So far this year we have given up our yearly cost of living pay increase as well as 64 hours furlough. The city has also provided no statistics or facts to support their saving estimate. I live two miles outside of the city limits and closer to my division than most in town officers do. In my years of service I have gotten many drunk drivers off the road and assisted citizens in trouble on my way to and from work. Take away my car and that won't happen. The city has offered the three officers other positions within the city, just not police positions. This means that they have the money and are just pushing for leverage. Tulsa police officers make less than OKC, Norman and Broken Arrow. Tulsa also requires a bachelors degree and the others do not. The city budget issue was caused by the mayor and city council, not the officers. We just risk our lives and don't get payed a whole lot to do it. Ron Palmer is an At-Will employee and a puppet of the mayor. He makes more money that any chief in TPD history and is not a voice for the officers. Tulsa Police policy states that all officers have to go through the Tulsa Police academy and work themselves through the ranks. Palmer is the only one representing TPD that didn't have meet this requirement. He's not one of us and never will be!

SKT, (11/7/2009 7:17:06 PM)
Issues of Fact: You don't have a clue. Idea, how much do you give a year to save someone. Their job, their life. Nada, you sit in your easy chair and quarterback for the rest of us. The way things are set up, officers salaries are payed for by sales tax. I'm pretty sure people in Jenks, BA, Owasso and other communities spend their money in Tulsa.

Four Sixteen Rigby, Tulsa (11/7/2009 6:47:49 AM)
Why should the TPD make concessions? They're cops. They're used to getting freebie coffee at QT and free dinner at the restaurant of their choice. They're used to telling people what to do and being able to legally taze and mace them if they don't comply. Making concessions is not in their DNA.

Issues of Fact, (11/7/2009 6:50:38 PM)
2curious is correct...as long as you live in Tulsa! In any other situation its crazy. I see no reason at all the police officers cant drive them home if they live in the city. The editorial is on the mark...as they hold benefit breakfast for 3 victims of greed (laid off brothers) the other 400K victims sit home and wonder how this happens. How can a group, sworn to serve and protect, care so little about citizen safety and their fellow officers that they cannot give up driving taxpayer vehicles outside of the city? It is beyond reason that the poll shows 88% of Tulsans (probably even more) oppose this but the police union doesnt care. In a time with a major investigation getting ready to issue a huge black eye and many citizens suffering greatly from the recession they refuse the loss of any "benefits." This choice will cause some major hard feelings and will not be soon forgotten. Seems a perfect opportunity to regain some public trust and good will is not only missed, but laughed at by the police officers. I dont see how this actually happens!

pissedtulsan, (11/7/2009 9:16:23 AM)
tbgalileo - Okay here's your answer: First off they DID NOT take a pay cut. They took days off without pay. They make it up easily working more at their $25 per hour side job that they use their (taxpayer) vehicle to get to and from on (taxpayer) gas. It does not effect their other benefits at all! Unless you consider not getting raiseS (plural) like most years this is all that TPD had sacrificed. And this is the first time TPD has had to do this. Now, except TFD, all other City departments have taken cuts almost every year over the past several years (TPD has not) the have in fact increased their budget. Other City employees have taken actual cuts to their existing wages with no day furloughs. Meaning that they have to work the same hours as always only for less pay per hour… but not the cops! theirs your difference. More differences – other City employees lost their take home vehicles several years back… not the cops though. Other city employees had their injury leave benefit reduce to 70% of their pay from 100% - that is a 30% reduction in benefit pay… not the cops though. Other City employee’s insurance benefit premiums went up but the benefit went down! … not the cops though Other City departments have reduced employee positions (lost jobs) almost every year for the last few years. Not the cops though! I could go on and on with this but I am pretty certain you already know this information. And that your agenda is to spread propaganda to help your cause. TPD and the FOP with out a doubt are nothing but a gang of bullies that until now have never had anyone stand up to their CHICKEN LITTLE SCARE TACTICS! This is a right to work state I would like to see the FOP hit the road myself. I truly believe they care mainly about their “true blue” club and could really care less about the overall safety of our city past how it might effect them doing their daily jobs!

TulsaComment, (11/7/2009 12:19:01 PM)
Several issues. I agree with a former respondent, rotate the police cars within the different shifts. Retain all city and county cars within the repective districts. These are business cars and should be utilized as such. If there is actual business to be conducted outside the districts, then acceptable. We all must make sacrifices during difficult times and the police and city officials are of no exception. You want to work in Tulsa, live in Tulsa, help the community prosper and grow. You want to live outside this area, find employment in those communities and help them. Too many times the cars in question are used for purposes other than for work...to and from home for TPD and the respondent was correct with the additional work for part-time police with their $25 an hour jobs. The officers didn't take a pay cut, they had no pay days off. Leave the TPD cars in the divion lots after your shift for other officers use and for service and repair and drive your own car. Everyone else drives their own car. Do you think the military provides you with a vehicle...think again. You want more money? Find a different job! There are police cars through my neighborhood, one right next door, with an eveing shift officer. Though his car was at home, It did not prevented my home from being burglarized during the day time, nor vandalizm done to many of my rolling stock, nor others in the neighborhood. Nice officer and a good neighbor, but the TPD car provides little or no benefit by being parked in that drive way daytime or nighttime. In closing, the union, with only 25% of the membership vote to retain the police cars, whereas 75% of the total members didn't even vote, you've got to be kidding us. Obviously the car is not much of an important issue to the majority of them.......take all cars away and use the money for further training and participation within the membership and the "brotherhood".

tulsamiddleoftheroad, Tulsa (11/7/2009 10:41:42 PM)
The main issue is taking a car home out of the city of tulsa, to skiatook, owasso, broken arrow, etc. If these citys want tulsa police to drive their cars in their towns, let them pay for it.

therealaxeman, (11/7/2009 10:01:24 PM)
SKT - You're just spreading more of the same ol' rhetoric propaganda as always. You guys make way more than the average city employee and you know it. You get compensated more for your degree than the average private sector workers with BS degree. It just that you equate not getting as big a raise or only getting one raise in a year in stead of two the same as the other city employees taking actual pay cuts plus not getting a raise at all! You guys have been coddled so long you actually believe that you are special and above everyone else! You guys need to suck it up like men instead of whimpering crybabies! The other City employees have been cut and cut and cut but you didn’t hear them whine like you guys are… Oh and about your statement that the take home cars are part of your salary not a benefit… and guess what everyone - the year these guys got that little token of appreciation - other city employees lost their jobs while the others took actual pay cuts! Yep that’s right folks – it was coined the “adopt a cop and feed a fireman program”. Like always they got theirs and the other city employees picked up the tab! Yep these boys have a degree all right… a degree in B.S.!

mrnotducks, Sand Springs (11/7/2009 10:36:14 AM)
There is also no public safety benefit of unmanned police cars sitting at the station either. So let's put "public safety" aside, shall we. I'm fairly sure that "public safety" was a tool used by city hall to make the deal that THEY made seem like a good idea at the time. It take TWO to tango but only one spread rumors and innuendo in an attempt sway public perception. Heil, Kathy!

mrnotducks, Sand Springs (11/7/2009 2:56:45 PM)
I think the funds generated by the police department should go to the police department and not in to the general funds to fund other departments within the city. If that would happen, then the police department would be self-sufficient. As it stands now, the police department doesn't even get a percentage of the funds they generate for the city. This is outrageous!! The police department should also start charging for sending officers to ignorant and wasteful calls where no crime has been committed. If this comment section is any example, the extra money will be flowing in no time.



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